Art starts the show from the high desert, greeting listeners from all over the globe, including the US Virgin Islands, South America, and beyond, emphasizing the broad reach of “Coast to Coast AM.” He introduces the Cassini mission, which aims to study Saturn’s atmosphere, magnetic field, rings, and moons, providing unprecedented insights into the planet and the solar system. Art teases that his guest, Karl Grossman, will discuss the potential downsides of this mission.
Art shares a personal victory over his computer issues and mentions the studio cameras are back online, inviting listeners to view the live feed on his website. He then introduces Karl Grossman, an investigative reporter with a focus on environmental and energy issues, highlighting his extensive background and numerous accolades, including the George Polk Award.
Karl Grossman joins the show to discuss the environmental risks of the Cassini mission, specifically the use of nuclear technology in space exploration. He expresses concern over the potential dangers of plutonium, used for electricity in the Cassini spacecraft, and its possible harmful effects on Earth if dispersed. Art and Karl delve into the importance of safe space exploration and the implications of using such hazardous materials in space missions.
Karl explains that the Cassini mission uses plutonium-238, which is significantly more radioactive than plutonium-239. This plutonium is used in radioisotope thermoelectric generators to produce electricity for the spacecraft. He highlights the risks associated with the Titan IV rocket, which will carry Cassini, noting its imperfect launch record. A launch failure could potentially release plutonium into the environment.
Art asks about the mission details, and Karl describes the use of a gravity assist maneuver, where Cassini will gain speed by flying by Venus and Earth before heading to Saturn. This complex trajectory poses risks, particularly if the spacecraft reenters Earth’s atmosphere by mistake. He discusses the potential catastrophic consequences if the plutonium were to be released during such an incident, including severe environmental and health hazards.
Karl emphasizes the extreme toxicity of plutonium, noting its potential to cause lung cancer if inhaled as dust or vapor. He cites NASA’s own environmental impact statement, which estimates that a significant portion of the plutonium could be released during a reentry accident, potentially affecting billions of people.
Karl continues by stating that NASA estimates the potential radiation exposure from a Cassini reentry accident could affect 99% of the world population, translating to about 2300 fatal cancers. However, independent scientists project fatalities far higher, with some estimates ranging from hundreds of thousands to millions. Despite the scientific benefits of exploring Saturn, Karl questions whether it’s worth the catastrophic risk.
Art shares his skepticism about NASA’s assurances regarding the safety of the plutonium containment. He recounts local advertisements showing robust testing of nuclear waste containers, implying a similar approach might be taken for Cassini. However, Karl reveals that the containment for Cassini’s plutonium is far from secure, describing it as thin iridium alloy shells. He emphasizes the dangers of these inadequate protections.
During the break, Art previews an upcoming show featuring interviews related to the Roswell incident, promising more intriguing discussions. Upon returning, Art reiterates the concerns about the plutonium containment, sarcastically noting the impracticality of NASA’s “bank vault” claims. Karl supports this by quoting NASA whistleblowers who dismiss the containment measures as insufficient, highlighting the real and present risks associated with the mission’s plutonium.
Karl continues to describe the inadequate shielding for the plutonium on Cassini, consisting of thin layers of iridium, graphite, and aluminum. He highlights the potential for a catastrophic release of plutonium if the spacecraft experiences a serious accident, especially during its planned high-speed flyby near Earth. This could result in the dispersal of plutonium particles, posing significant health risks.
Art and Karl discuss NASA’s claims that the likelihood of a catastrophic accident is very slim. However, Karl challenges these assurances by pointing out the historical failure rates of Titan IV rockets and the inherent risks of space missions. He criticizes NASA’s optimistic probability estimates, comparing the Cassini mission’s flyby maneuver to aiming a gun containing plutonium at Earth.
Karl further explains that space missions often rely on precise midcourse maneuvers and burns, which can be prone to errors. He recalls past mission failures, such as the Mars Observer, emphasizing the unpredictable nature of space exploration. Karl and Art agree that while space exploration is inherently risky, the potential consequences of a Cassini failure are far more severe, potentially endangering millions of lives due to plutonium contamination.
Karl highlights NASA’s environmental impact statement, which details potential decontamination methods if plutonium contaminates the environment. These methods include removing topsoil, relocating animals, destroying crops, and demolishing structures. He underscores the immense logistical and financial burdens, including the permanent relocation of affected populations. Karl calculates NASA’s worst-case cleanup cost at $10 trillion, with more probable scenarios still costing around $100 billion, questioning who will bear these costs, emphasizing it would likely be American taxpayers.
Art and Karl discuss the timeline and power requirements of the Cassini mission, set to generate 745 watts with plutonium. Karl argues that high-efficiency solar cells could replace plutonium, citing advancements by the European Space Agency and Deutsche Aerospace. He notes that solar technology has been successfully used in other space missions and could be adapted for Cassini, though it would require redesigning the probe.
Karl explains that while the sun’s intensity decreases at Saturn’s distance, new solar cells could still function effectively. He mentions that the European Space Agency’s upcoming Rosetta mission will use solar power, demonstrating the feasibility of this approach. Additionally, he suggests fuel cells as a supplemental power source if solar energy alone is insufficient for the entire mission to Saturn.
Karl elaborates on the efficiency of the new solar cells, which achieve a 25% efficiency rate, making them viable for deep-space missions despite the reduced solar intensity at distances like Saturn. He criticizes NASA’s choice to use plutonium, highlighting that 745 watts is roughly the power of a hairdryer, which could be generated by high-efficiency solar cells instead.
Art and Karl discuss the history of plutonium use in space missions, noting a 1964 incident where a US satellite with 21 pounds of plutonium disintegrated upon reentry, spreading plutonium globally. Karl links this to increased lung cancer rates, emphasizing the dangers of using such toxic materials. They question the necessity of using 723 pounds of plutonium for Cassini, stressing the risks involved.
Returning from a break, Art summarizes the Cassini mission’s objectives and potential risks, reiterating the catastrophic consequences of a launch failure or a miscalculated flyby near Earth. Karl argues that the push for an October 6th launch is driven by pressure from Lockheed Martin, the manufacturer, and political factors rather than safety concerns. He suggests that with a few more years of development, solar technology could safely power Cassini, eliminating the need for plutonium and its associated risks.
Karl details the powerful influence of Lockheed Martin and other large corporations, like General Electric and Westinghouse, in promoting the use of plutonium systems in space missions. These corporations, alongside national nuclear laboratories, have a vested interest in continuing nuclear projects to stay active post-Cold War.
Karl shares his investigative journey, explaining the difficulties in obtaining information about NASA’s nuclear missions. He initially viewed NASA positively but became skeptical after encountering resistance when requesting documents through the Freedom of Information Act. His suspicions were confirmed when he received documents detailing potential catastrophic accidents involving plutonium-fueled space probes, contradicting NASA’s assurances of low risk.
He recounts his experience in 1986, when the Challenger disaster occurred. Karl had previously obtained documents claiming the shuttle had a 1 in 100,000 chance of an accident. The Challenger’s explosion, slated to carry 25 pounds of plutonium on its next mission, highlighted the real dangers of using plutonium in space missions. The potential spread of plutonium from such an accident could have led to widespread contamination and significantly more casualties than just the astronauts on board.
Karl recounts his efforts to alert the public and the media about the potential dangers of plutonium-fueled space missions, following the Challenger disaster. He describes how his investigative work revealed prior accidents involving plutonium in space, including the SNAP-9A satellite in 1964, which spread plutonium globally. He also mentions a Russian satellite that disintegrated over Canada, scattering radioactive debris.
Karl emphasizes the risks of the Cassini mission’s planned flyby near Earth, which could potentially reenter the atmosphere if miscalculated, dispersing plutonium over a densely populated area. He criticizes NASA’s method of averaging the potential radiation dose globally, rather than considering localized, high-exposure scenarios in metropolitan areas like Los Angeles or New York.
Art and Karl discuss the unpredictability of reentry paths, referencing past incidents where satellites reentered far from their predicted locations. Karl highlights the gravity of the situation by describing an incident where President Clinton had to warn Australia’s Prime Minister about a Russian space probe with plutonium potentially reentering near Australia, illustrating the serious international implications of such accidents.
Karl explains the radioactive properties of plutonium-238, which has a much shorter half-life and higher decay rate than plutonium-239, making it extremely “hot” and dangerous. This material is used in the radioisotope thermoelectric generators to produce electricity. He reiterates the significant risks involved if this plutonium were to be released due to an accident.
Art and Karl discuss the inaccuracies and unpredictability of reentry paths for space objects, referencing a previous incident where a Russian Mars space probe was predicted to reenter over Western Australia but ultimately fell in Chile, far from its expected location. This unpredictability heightens the risk of a miscalculation during Cassini’s flyby, potentially causing it to reenter Earth’s atmosphere.
Returning from a break, Art recaps the upcoming Cassini mission’s planned trajectory and the associated risks to the public, emphasizing the need for transparency from NASA regarding these dangers. He mentions that Karl has a website linked on their page for further information. Art also shares a listener’s story about experiencing pain before an earthquake, and other recent seismic activities around the world.
Karl continues to discuss the significant risks associated with plutonium use in space missions, emphasizing the highly radioactive nature of plutonium-238. He mentions the role of the US Space Command in tracking space objects and advising on potential reentries, as was the case with the Russian Mars probe.
In a break from the main topic, Art interacts with listeners calling in with various observations and questions. One listener from Salem, Oregon, describes visiting a crop circle, while another from north of Seattle reports seeing the sky turn red and experiencing a power outage. Art humorously speculates about a “dimensional door” opening, causing the phenomena, and suggests the caller report the incident to the Seattle UFO Reporting Center.
Returning to the Cassini mission, Art reiterates the importance of public awareness regarding the risks involved in using plutonium for space missions. He highlights the potential for catastrophic accidents that could result in widespread contamination and health hazards.
One caller from Missoula, Montana, inquires about a previous program on reverse speech and how to play tapes backwards. Art explains the need for a special recorder or a computer and mentions that David Oates sells such equipment.
Another caller from St. Louis asks about channeling and Art’s views on Lori Toye, who was previously featured on the show. Art expresses skepticism about channeling due to the potential for fraud but acknowledges that some individuals, like Lori Toye, are interesting.
A listener from British Columbia joins the conversation, discussing the improbability of reentry errors during the Cassini mission’s slingshot maneuver. Art agrees that NASA should disclose the actual risks to the public. They also discuss the contributions of Canada to space missions, including the construction of components like the robotic arm used on the shuttle.
The caller raises a valid point about the global implications of a potential plutonium accident, noting that the environmental and health impacts would extend beyond the United States. They discuss the elevated cancer rates in British Columbia and the possible links to environmental contamination from past space accidents involving plutonium.
Art reiterates the upcoming Cassini mission, which is scheduled to launch on October 6th and will involve a complex maneuver where the spacecraft will use Earth’s gravity to slingshot towards Saturn. This involves Cassini coming within 2 to 500 miles of Earth at a speed of 42,000 mph, raising concerns about potential reentry and the dispersal of 723 pounds of plutonium in the event of an accident.
Art emphasizes the need for public awareness regarding the risks associated with such missions, noting that NASA’s safety estimates, like those for the space shuttle Challenger, have proven overly optimistic in the past. He calls for more transparency from NASA, suggesting that the public has a right to know the potential dangers they face.
The conversation then shifts to various current events, including Mike Tyson’s ban from boxing, new TV rating systems, and President Clinton’s high approval rating due to the strong economy. Art also mentions the ongoing Mars rover mission, which continues to explore and analyze rocks on Mars. Additionally, he reports on a recent earthquake in Venezuela that killed 28 people, highlighting the unpredictability and danger of natural disasters.
Art shares more intriguing tidbits about the dangers faced by cosmonauts when dealing with the depressurized lab on the space station, including floating glass shards and toxic spills. He also discusses a speculative NASA program involving the transformation of astronauts into cyborgs for long voyages, a concept that faces opposition from medical professionals and scientists due to the extreme alterations required.
He mentions a recent crop circle discovery near Salem, Oregon, and promises to share photographs once available. Art then opens the phone lines for unscreened calls, allowing listeners to discuss various topics. One caller shares his excitement about Art’s show and recounts reconnecting with a childhood friend through a person locator link.
Another caller from Milwaukee informs Art about the “White Cloud” military satellite cluster, believed to be capable of changing direction and possibly used for imaging or spying. They speculate about the presence of spy satellites and the likelihood of undisclosed space activities, including the potential existence of nuclear weapons in space, despite treaties prohibiting them.
Art continues with open lines, addressing a question about what CBC stands for (Chancellor Broadcasting). He also receives updates on the Art Bell Chat Club, announcing new chapters and meetings, including international interest from England. Art expresses excitement about potentially being broadcast in Britain and provides the international toll-free number for listeners worldwide.
Art highlights the advancements in real audio technology, enabling more people globally to tune into his show via the internet. He encourages international callers to use the provided toll-free number to join the conversation, emphasizing the growing reach of his broadcast.
He humorously shares the top ten reasons to launch the Cassini mission, including job security, disposing of plutonium stockpiles, and testing emergency broadcast systems. These reasons reflect both the scientific and practical considerations behind space missions, underscoring the broader implications of such endeavors.
Art continues discussing various topics with his listeners. He mentions the idea of setting up an outdoor webcam, potentially coupled with a telescope, to capture the desert sky, although weatherproofing remains a challenge.
Art shares updates on recent earthquakes, including an upgraded quake in Venezuela and a mudslide in Kyushu, Japan. He takes a call from an 87-year-old woman who recalls participating in one of his previous collective telepathic experiments to summon UFOs, humorously recounting an encounter with a mysterious object.
A caller from Missoula, Montana, inquires about Art’s interviews on reverse speech, prompting Art to explain the process of playing tapes backward and mentioning that David Oates sells the necessary equipment.
Another listener from Salem, Oregon, reports on a local crop circle, emphasizing the difficulty of seeing it from the ground and the need for aerial photographs. Art encourages the caller to have the circle’s owner contact him for further documentation.
Art continues to interact with listeners, providing his fax number for a caller interested in sharing crop circle photos and discussing the limitations on fax lengths. Another caller from north of Seattle describes witnessing the sky turning red, a power outage, and the strange sensation that followed, prompting Art to humorously suggest it might have been a “dimensional door” opening, possibly bringing strange creatures.
Another listener from St. Louis asks about Lori Toye and channeling. Art expresses skepticism about channeling due to the potential for fraud but acknowledges that some individuals, like Lori Toye, are interesting. He explains that while he is not entirely against channeling, he finds it difficult to discern genuine cases from fraudulent ones.
A caller from British Columbia discusses the improbability of reentry errors during the Cassini mission’s slingshot maneuver, highlighting the precision of NASA’s calculations. Art agrees that while the risks might be low, the public still has a right to be informed about them.
Art continues discussing the Cassini mission with a caller from British Columbia. The caller points out that a minor error in the spacecraft’s trajectory could result in it missing Earth by hundreds of thousands of miles, rather than hitting it. They agree that NASA has a responsibility to inform the public about the actual risks. The conversation shifts to Canada’s role in space exploration, including contributions like the Canadarm and modems for the Pathfinder mission.
The caller expresses concern about the environmental and health impacts of potential plutonium contamination, mentioning the high cancer rates in British Columbia despite its limited heavy industry. They highlight the danger of plutonium spreading globally if released into the atmosphere.
Art reiterates the international toll-free number for listeners and transitions to lighter topics, such as humorous comments about the Cassini mission. Another caller from Portland questions the decision-making process behind allowing missions with significant risks, noting NASA’s history of underestimating the likelihood of catastrophic failures. Art emphasizes the need for transparency from NASA, asserting that the public has a right to know the true risks associated with such missions.
Art and a caller continue discussing the potential risks of the Cassini mission and the need for public awareness. The caller emphasizes that NASA should be transparent about the dangers, especially given the use of 70-plus pounds of highly toxic plutonium-238. Art concurs, underscoring the importance of informing the public about the mission’s risks and advocating for a national debate on the subject.
Art revisits the specific dangers posed by the Cassini mission, including the launch on a Titan IV rocket and the spacecraft’s close flyby of Earth to gain speed for its journey to Saturn. He explains that any error during this maneuver could result in catastrophic consequences, with plutonium potentially being dispersed in the atmosphere.
The conversation shifts to listener calls, where one caller from Lake Stevens backs up a previous caller’s report about strange electrical phenomena. Another caller from Albany, New York, praises the effectiveness of a Select-A-Tenna for improving radio reception.
A caller from Florida, originally from New Orleans, claims to be a vampire and discusses the lack of media attention on vampirism beyond sensationalized portrayals in movies and television. The caller shares an attempt to hold a press conference in New York to go public with information about vampirism, which was ignored by legitimate media sources.
Art continues his conversation with the self-proclaimed vampire from Florida, delving deeper into the realities and misconceptions of vampirism. The caller explains that vampires are indeed affected by sunlight, which drains their energy, making them creatures of the night. However, they do not burn up as depicted in movies, which is disinformation. The moon, on the other hand, energizes them.
The caller admits to drinking blood, both human and animal, but primarily sticks to animal blood obtained through butcher shops. This practice is more ethical and avoids the risks associated with consuming human blood. The caller shares that there was a vampire bar in New Orleans called the Blue Crystal, where they served blood mixed with alcoholic beverages.
Art learns that the caller became a vampire at 14, introduced by a woman. The vampire lifestyle offers heightened senses and a certain social status, particularly in a city like New Orleans with its European influences and connections to the West Indies. The caller also mentions Anne Rice, noting that her work contains more truth than fiction and that she was aided by a vampire, which contributed to her success.
The caller describes a slowed aging process, looking much younger than their actual age. Drinking blood is not as distasteful as one might think due to flavoring, and it is often ingested through food and drinks rather than directly from the source.
The caller expresses a desire to inform the public about the true nature of vampirism, motivated by concerns for today’s youth and the societal impacts of a lost generation. Vampirism is more widespread than people realize, with many vampires not fitting the stereotypical gothic image but rather integrating into society in more subtle ways.
The conversation with the self-proclaimed vampire takes a more ominous turn as the caller suggests that there is a plan to dispose of the current generation, indicating a bleak outlook for the future of humanity. They claim there are over a million vampires in America, including prominent figures in Hollywood and major corporations, and even allege that Walt Disney was a vampire.
Art expresses disbelief and concern about these revelations, questioning the caller’s motives for wanting to go public. The caller explains that the goal is to inform people and stop hiding the truth about vampirism. The conversation ends with Art agreeing to check his email for more information from the caller and thanking them for the unusual discussion.
The show then moves to a segment on a new crop circle discovery. Art introduces Marianne Koch, who found the double crop circle in a wheat field near Highway 22. Marianne describes how she first noticed the circle while driving home and later returned to investigate. She explains that the circle is very precise and not caused by sprinklers or other usual field anomalies. The double circle has an opening from the center to the edge, making it a unique and interesting formation.
Marianne Koch continues to describe her experience with the crop circle she discovered. After initially contacting a local newspaper without much success, she reached out to a larger paper in Portland, which sent reporters and took aerial photographs of the circle. Marianne also went up in a plane to take pictures, noting that the crop circle is relatively small but very clean and precise.
She explains that the crop circle measures 45-55 feet across and has a unique “signature” off to the side. This signature is an area of unusual grass that exhibits high levels of anomalies, as reported by the Research Center for Crop Circle Studies. Marianne mentions Dr. Levengood, known for studying crop circles, and hopes that samples taken by another researcher, Skip, were sent to him for analysis.
The farmer who owns the field discovered the crop circle a few days before Marianne and was initially reluctant to publicize it due to concerns about people trampling his crops. Marianne understands this concern and notes that most visitors have been respectful, staying on a designated path.
Marianne and Art discuss the energy patterns visible in the photographs, which show subtle lines and swirls across the field. Marianne plans to send the photos to Art, who will scan and share them on his website. They talk about the difficulty of determining whether the crop circle was human-made, as there were minimal tracks initially.
Marianne also shares her background in remote viewing and describes how she remotely viewed the crop circle, experiencing some physical effects like headaches, which are common in areas with high electromagnetic energy. She hopes Skip will call back to provide more details and fill in any gaps.
Marianne Koch provides additional updates on the crop circle she discovered, mentioning that after it was reported in the newspaper, she received calls about other possible crop circles in the area. She describes various unusual phenomena in Oregon, including triangular shapes and lights in the sky.
Art provides his mailing address so Marianne can send him photographs of the crop circle, which he plans to share on his website. He reflects on the strange times and the sense of impending events felt by many.
A caller from Melbourne, Australia, named Mark, comments on the show and mentions an interesting article about a man from Sacramento selling plots on the moon and Mars. Art discusses the entrepreneurial spirit behind selling celestial real estate and the novelty of naming stars for a fee.
Art then speaks with a caller from Alabama who wanted to ask the vampire guest about their stance on nuclear power, humorously comparing the sun to a giant hydrogen bomb. The caller expresses concerns about technophobia, suggesting that fear of technology is more dangerous than plutonium, and humorously posits a conspiracy theory involving vampires controlling space probes and the sun.
A caller humorously describes the idea of an “Alabama redneck vampire,” imagining them with an IV bottle in the back of their pickup truck. Another caller from Pasco, Washington, inquires about the existence of men in black. Art confirms their existence and hints at their secretive operations, jokingly avoiding giving specifics about their headquarters.
The conversation shifts to Art’s choice of cigarettes, revealing he smokes Carlton 120s, which have very low tar and nicotine content. This often leads to other smokers declining when he offers them a cigarette, finding them too mild.
A first-time caller shares a childhood memory from San Francisco, recounting seeing her sister with two men in black, one of whom had a syringe. This unsettling experience has stayed with her throughout her life. Art mentions that he will have a guest on the show to discuss the serious topic of men in black, acknowledging the gravity of her story.
Art wraps up the program, thanking listeners from America, Canada, Australia, and beyond, and signing off for the night from the high desert.